Latin Composition

Forum and collegium dedicated to the teaching, writing, speaking and interpretation of Latin, ancient Greek and other languages of related cultures.

Moderator: Aldus Marius

Latin Composition

Postby Q Valerius on Thu Sep 01, 2005 1:00 am

Just wandering if anyone could check my Latin for errors etc...

"'Exemplar' humanus est qui omnes cum maximo honore observemus. Prope animam tres virtutes muneraque tenet. Prima simplus est qui caritates haud necessarie habet; honestus qui vera omnia semper loquitur; aequus quoque qui omnibus bona decoraque dat. Fidelitas in se, pietas in deo, ac humilitas in aliis. Sapiens de rebus iusticis omnibus caelorum mundique, et gentes a moribus eius iudicare potest. Viri paenitendi errorum speculant ac genibus cadunt. Cogitationes puri sic verba pura sic homines a doctrina stupent. Mali etiam stupent, qui non urbis perturbit, vel servantur vel verentur. Vir infinitus ne catenis victus at liber ad persequendum monasticiae, et cum mortem appropinquat, portae regiae caelarum apperiuntur ac pace in aeternitate dormit. Vero vitam hanc vicit, nam perfectus exemplum.

Sagax, prudentissimus hominum est. Oraculum, nam se scit. Miles, pugnans pace usque ad inluminationem. Ne luciferianus ne noctiferianus, at in harmonia perfecta. Via optima eius, sed maxima est amare."
Q Valerius
Eques
Eques
 
Posts: 393
Joined: Tue Nov 09, 2004 7:06 am

Postby Iacobulus on Thu Nov 17, 2005 2:10 am

Haven't gone over all of it, but from first sentence I think your use of the relative pronoun "qui" should be in the accusative case: "quem" since it appears to be the direct object of "observemus." ("WHOM we would?should/might regard great honor.")

Also, did you intend for "observemus"? It is a first declension verb, and your form would be the present subjunctive.
Quis fallere possit amantem? ~ P. Vergilius Maro
Quidquid bene dictum est ab ullo, meum est ~L. Anneus Seneca
User avatar
Iacobulus
I. Auxiliary
I. Auxiliary
 
Posts: 27
Joined: Thu Nov 17, 2005 1:51 am
Location: Lexington, KY

Postby Q Valerius on Fri Nov 18, 2005 12:13 am

Ah, yes, of course. quem. But I did intend for the subjunctive there (hortative).
Q Valerius
Eques
Eques
 
Posts: 393
Joined: Tue Nov 09, 2004 7:06 am

Postby Iacobulus on Fri Nov 18, 2005 7:37 pm

Hortatory is the correct term, actually. However, you don't see too much usage of the hortatory subjunctive in a relative clause. Because if you translate the hortatory as "Let us do" so and so, then it is awkward. Maybe if it were made into a deliberative (whom we should) or potential subjunctive (whom we would/could).

Sorry to pick, but I'm currently taking a Latin composition class, so this very relevant to me!.

The rest seems fine, albeit a bit elementary, very St. Jerome. Not that it's a bad thing, a certain amount of poinancy can be had from simplistic syntax, rather than being bogged down in Ciceronian rhetoric.

However, I would perhaps add a few more conjunctions to liven it up a bit and give it a better flow. Maybe some connective conjunctions (igitur, ergo, itaque, etc.) or some adversative (sed, autem, tamen). I also see the potentional for a lot more periaphrastic constructions with gerundives (must and so forth).

What is this for exactly?
[/i]
Quis fallere possit amantem? ~ P. Vergilius Maro
Quidquid bene dictum est ab ullo, meum est ~L. Anneus Seneca
User avatar
Iacobulus
I. Auxiliary
I. Auxiliary
 
Posts: 27
Joined: Thu Nov 17, 2005 1:51 am
Location: Lexington, KY

Postby Primus Aurelius Timavus on Fri Nov 18, 2005 11:11 pm

Salve Iacobule,

Sorry to pick, but it's "potential" :D

My Latin teacher used to call the horatory subjunctive the "salad subjunctive" because more often than not it was translated "Let us..". It was one of those school boy mnemonics like "dic, duc, fac and fer should have an 'e' but it isn't there" and "We beat all liars" (the endings of each conjugation in the present subjunctive). I'm curious: are those still taught today? I last studied Latin 25 years ago and these rules stuck with me.

Tergestus
Primus Aurelius Timavus
Curator, Rogator, Praetor et Patricius
Civis Romanus Sum
User avatar
Primus Aurelius Timavus
Curator
Curator
 
Posts: 524
Joined: Sat Sep 14, 2002 11:14 pm
Location: America Italiaque

Postby Q Valerius on Sat Nov 19, 2005 8:49 am

Iacobulus wrote:Hortatory is the correct term, actually. However, you don't see too much usage of the hortatory subjunctive in a relative clause. Because if you translate the hortatory as "Let us do" so and so, then it is awkward. Maybe if it were made into a deliberative (whom we should) or potential subjunctive (whom we would/could).

Hortative is incorrect, then. Subjunctive, still, though. The English which I started from.at this point is "The Exemplar is a human whom we all should respect with the greatest honor."

Sorry to pick, but I'm currently taking a Latin composition class, so this very relevant to me!.

No! I actually needed a person to talk with, for, as you can see, no one else was interested.

The rest seems fine, albeit a bit elementary, very St. Jerome. Not that it's a bad thing, a certain amount of poinancy can be had from simplistic syntax, rather than being bogged down in Ciceronian rhetoric.

Well, considering the subject matter, it probably be better simplistic. However, as much as I like simplicity (quod necesse est) I don't necessarily like naivite, which is why I posted it here.

However, I would perhaps add a few more conjunctions to liven it up a bit and give it a better flow. Maybe some connective conjunctions (igitur, ergo, itaque, etc.) or some adversative (sed, autem, tamen). I also see the potentional for a lot more periaphrastic constructions with gerundives (must and so forth).

Perhaps you can point to a couple of rough spots? And yes, this is constantly revised.

What is this for exactly?

Personal philosophy.
Q Valerius
Eques
Eques
 
Posts: 393
Joined: Tue Nov 09, 2004 7:06 am

Postby Q Valerius on Sat Nov 19, 2005 8:50 am

Primus Aurelius Tergestus wrote:Salve Iacobule,

Sorry to pick, but it's "potential" :D

My Latin teacher used to call the horatory subjunctive the "salad subjunctive" because more often than not it was translated "Let us..". It was one of those school boy mnemonics like "dic, duc, fac and fer should have an 'e' but it isn't there" and "We beat all liars" (the endings of each conjugation in the present subjunctive). I'm curious: are those still taught today? I last studied Latin 25 years ago and these rules stuck with me.

Tergestus


I learned those as "dic, duc, fac, fer; drop the /e/ it should be there" and "We beat a liar" for those two. Wow, 25 years and it seems as nothing changed!
Q Valerius
Eques
Eques
 
Posts: 393
Joined: Tue Nov 09, 2004 7:06 am

Postby Primus Aurelius Timavus on Sat Nov 19, 2005 3:31 pm

Also, it is "periphrastic".
Primus Aurelius Timavus
Curator, Rogator, Praetor et Patricius
Civis Romanus Sum
User avatar
Primus Aurelius Timavus
Curator
Curator
 
Posts: 524
Joined: Sat Sep 14, 2002 11:14 pm
Location: America Italiaque

Postby Q Valerius on Sun Nov 20, 2005 1:19 am

Primus Aurelius Tergestus wrote:Also, it is "periphrastic".

I'm sure it was merely a typographical error.
Q Valerius
Eques
Eques
 
Posts: 393
Joined: Tue Nov 09, 2004 7:06 am

Postby Iacobulus on Sun Nov 20, 2005 10:23 pm

Primus Aurelius Tergestus wrote:Salve Iacobule,

Sorry to pick, but it's "potential" :D

My Latin teacher used to call the horatory subjunctive the "salad subjunctive" because more often than not it was translated "Let us..". It was one of those school boy mnemonics like "dic, duc, fac and fer should have an 'e' but it isn't there" and "We beat all liars" (the endings of each conjugation in the present subjunctive). I'm curious: are those still taught today? I last studied Latin 25 years ago and these rules stuck with me.

Tergestus


Of course. Actually, if you look at my post, I said it would be better if it were potential or deliberative, aguing against the hortatory. So actually I did realize that.

And yes, "periaphrastic" was a typo.
Quis fallere possit amantem? ~ P. Vergilius Maro
Quidquid bene dictum est ab ullo, meum est ~L. Anneus Seneca
User avatar
Iacobulus
I. Auxiliary
I. Auxiliary
 
Posts: 27
Joined: Thu Nov 17, 2005 1:51 am
Location: Lexington, KY

Postby Iacobulus on Sun Nov 20, 2005 10:27 pm

Quinte:

At my university (U of Kentucky), we are fairly well-renown for our Latin Institute, which is a four-course graduate program taught entirely in Latin.

Also, every summer the department hosts a conventiculum, in which scholars from all around come to discuss Latin in Latin.

I've only just begun learning to actually communicate in Latin, and it is quite a daunting task to carry on a conversation in Latin.
Quis fallere possit amantem? ~ P. Vergilius Maro
Quidquid bene dictum est ab ullo, meum est ~L. Anneus Seneca
User avatar
Iacobulus
I. Auxiliary
I. Auxiliary
 
Posts: 27
Joined: Thu Nov 17, 2005 1:51 am
Location: Lexington, KY

Postby Q Valerius on Mon Nov 21, 2005 8:15 am

If you ever feel the need to try it out, #latin on EFNet is my channel where we sometimes speak in Latin.
Q Valerius
Eques
Eques
 
Posts: 393
Joined: Tue Nov 09, 2004 7:06 am

Postby Iacobulus on Mon Nov 21, 2005 8:53 pm

Quin hic Latine loquimur? Fortasse sit forum ad linguam Latinam loquendam?

Valde difficilum est loqui Latine, multo difficilius quam scribere Latine.
Quis fallere possit amantem? ~ P. Vergilius Maro
Quidquid bene dictum est ab ullo, meum est ~L. Anneus Seneca
User avatar
Iacobulus
I. Auxiliary
I. Auxiliary
 
Posts: 27
Joined: Thu Nov 17, 2005 1:51 am
Location: Lexington, KY

Postby Iacobulus on Mon Nov 21, 2005 8:56 pm

Q. Valerius Scerio wrote:If you ever feel the need to try it out, #latin on EFNet is my channel where we sometimes speak in Latin.


Thanks for the offer, I may look into, but believe me when I say that I get plenty of practice here! The second part of my Latin composition class is completely in Latin, lecture, discussion, everything. It's next semester! I hope I'm prepared, I've only been practicing conversational Latin during this semester. Bona fortuna mihi.
Quis fallere possit amantem? ~ P. Vergilius Maro
Quidquid bene dictum est ab ullo, meum est ~L. Anneus Seneca
User avatar
Iacobulus
I. Auxiliary
I. Auxiliary
 
Posts: 27
Joined: Thu Nov 17, 2005 1:51 am
Location: Lexington, KY

Postby Cleopatra Aelia on Mon Nov 21, 2005 9:56 pm

Salve Iacobule,

Iacobulus wrote:At my university (U of Kentucky), we are fairly well-renown for our Latin Institute, which is a four-course graduate program taught entirely in Latin.

Also, every summer the department hosts a conventiculum, in which scholars from all around come to discuss Latin in Latin.

I've only just begun learning to actually communicate in Latin, and it is quite a daunting task to carry on a conversation in Latin.


Maybe I would've loved my Latin classes at school much more if we practised speaking it. But all we did was translating from Latin into German and very often that was a big discussion if it was possible to translate it that way or the other way. In the end I didn't know if the translation a fellow studen suggested was correct or not.

I learned Latin for four year but couldn't have a decent conversation in that language. The only things I still remember is that what we use here to greet others etc.
Cleopatra Aelia
alias Medusa Gladiatrix
User avatar
Cleopatra Aelia
Curialis
Curialis
 
Posts: 353
Joined: Wed Jan 05, 2005 12:57 pm
Location: Hamburg, Germania

Postby Q Valerius on Tue Nov 22, 2005 8:41 am

Iacobulus wrote:
Q. Valerius Scerio wrote:If you ever feel the need to try it out, #latin on EFNet is my channel where we sometimes speak in Latin.


Thanks for the offer, I may look into, but believe me when I say that I get plenty of practice here! The second part of my Latin composition class is completely in Latin, lecture, discussion, everything. It's next semester! I hope I'm prepared, I've only been practicing conversational Latin during this semester. Bona fortuna mihi.

Ita vero, multa fortunae tibi vero! Eheu, mi amice, sole in Latinam? Difficillimum etiam mihi!
Q Valerius
Eques
Eques
 
Posts: 393
Joined: Tue Nov 09, 2004 7:06 am

Postby Iacobulus on Tue Nov 22, 2005 7:20 pm

Q. Valerius Scerio wrote:Ita vero, multa fortunae tibi vero! Eheu, mi amice, sole in Latinam? Difficillimum etiam mihi!


Sane, Quinti, sed non ita difficile facere est, ut non possit solum Latine loqui. Ab nostris est exercendum!

Aliquis optime opera auctorum Romanorum transire atque legere possit, sed ceterum idem ipse haud bene loqui Latine, velut Anglice. Noli te pudere, quod paulo male loqueris Latine.

Quis est custos fori huius? Res ad linguam Latinam loquendam est instituenda!
Quis fallere possit amantem? ~ P. Vergilius Maro
Quidquid bene dictum est ab ullo, meum est ~L. Anneus Seneca
User avatar
Iacobulus
I. Auxiliary
I. Auxiliary
 
Posts: 27
Joined: Thu Nov 17, 2005 1:51 am
Location: Lexington, KY

Postby Q Valerius on Thu Nov 24, 2005 2:06 pm

Iacobulus wrote:Quis est custos fori huius? Res ad linguam Latinam loquendam est instituenda!

Puto ut Tiberius Dionysius Draco et K. C. Duellianus sunt, sed tamen hic numquam video.
Q Valerius
Eques
Eques
 
Posts: 393
Joined: Tue Nov 09, 2004 7:06 am

Bene esset Latine loqui

Postby Valerius Claudius Iohanes on Thu Feb 23, 2006 4:06 am

Latine loqui est quod necessito ego. Bona ratio. Scio linguam meam barbaram esse sed propter hoc ipsum volo practicare.
Valerius Claudius Iohannes
Curator anno MMDCCLXII
Centurio Honorarius Societatis

:: Adversitas bono viro intelligentiam docet. ::
User avatar
Valerius Claudius Iohanes
Curator
Curator
 
Posts: 674
Joined: Thu Sep 09, 2004 4:28 am
Location: Sancti Leandri Oppidum, California Franciscencis, Conpactae Civitates Americae

Postby Primus Aurelius Timavus on Thu Feb 23, 2006 4:16 am

Damn Valeri Claudi, I like your Latin. Knowing Spanish very well and Italian pretty well, I can understand it just fine without breaking out my Latin grammars and dictionaries. Maybe you've unknowingly rediscovered the spoken, vice literary, Latin that developed into the Romance languages. Congratulations!
Primus Aurelius Timavus
Curator, Rogator, Praetor et Patricius
Civis Romanus Sum
User avatar
Primus Aurelius Timavus
Curator
Curator
 
Posts: 524
Joined: Sat Sep 14, 2002 11:14 pm
Location: America Italiaque

Next

Return to Collegium Linguarum

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests

cron